Saturday, February 18, 2006

The Sound of a Suckout

OK. Hand 4. 4. Do you understand? The 4th deal of a 6 handed, 18 player SNG. Hero is in the BB, and gets dealt AcAs. Villain is in the SB. Blinds are obviously 10/20. UTG fires out a raise to 100. Fold, call, fold. SB calls the raise. I reraise another 80, and get 3 callers, including SB. Now, of the 3 hands we played to this point, villain sucked out the first two (J8o and 67o) and I won the 3rd with 2 pair A/T. So I figured asslick was probably just enjoying the big stack and feeling cocky from his two suckouts, and didn't have a real hand, much less one that could beat AA. Flop comes 2sQc9s. I don't think villain has QQ, maybe Qx, so I'm not afraid. Still, all I have is Aces and a backdoor nut flush draw, so I throw out a bet of 100. Asslick pushes, and he's got me covered by about 500, so I go all in. He flips over Q7s. Ok, it's suited, but not a hand I'd expect any rational player to be willing to call so much preflop action with. OK. I want no spades or 2 spades. Turn is Tc. River guessed it...5s!!! S for suckout! Hopefully I'll last longer than 4 hands in the next one!


Nick Christy said...

Bad beat man, nothing to do except keep playing... I am not sure I like your reraise of $80 preflop though. I think you gave everyone value to get in the hand.

You have 300 in the pot when it is your turn with 2 callers in front of you. Raising to $180 makes it $80 to see a pot of $480 for the first caller (6-1 odds) and if he calls $80 to see a pot of $560 for the second caller (7-1 odds) I would probably raise pot there, make it 300 more. The first caller now has to put $300 in the pot to see a $600 pot. You are bound to either take the pot there or get two handed to the flop. This is the key when playing aces, you cant go three,four,five handed to the flop. Get heads up and take their money.

Keep up the good work with your blog.

iamhoff said...

Yeah, that's one thing I haven't gotten around to yet, is calculating pot odds or calling values. I'm still newbie enough that I tend to focus more on my hand and how do I bet my hand as opposed to how do I play the pot, for myself or my opponents. Oh well, I'm sure I'll start to work on that aspect of my game soon. Thanks for the advice, though. Pot odds are definitely a factor that I need to start dealing with.

On another note, the RSX is a great vehicle (as a former Integra owner), but Jax was looking for a family vehicle and the Mazda 5 is more than the Mazda3 5 door and not quite a full minivan, so that he can avoid the stigma of driving a minivan.

TripJax said...

The first thing I thought about when I read your post was $80 being way too small a raise. But I see you mentioned you recognized that, so no biggie. A good thing to do at that point is to check the total pot when it gets around to you and adjust your raise based on it rather than basing it on the original bettor's 100. If I'm adding correctly, when it got to you there was 320 in the pot and you only raised 80. With Aces, if you pump it up to about 200 - 300 you are making a statement that the pot is yours and they are going to have to pay to play.

If everyone folds you take the 320 and don't get sucked out on. If someone raises you can push and be a favorite heads up. If not everyone folds, you probably only get one caller, 2 max. Your chances increase when you eliminate pot odds for most of the players.

Just my two cents.

On the car note, I'm picking up the Mazda5 tomorrow! We got a killer deal and are extremely excited.

Zoom Zoom Zoom.

OK that last line was gay. Sorry.

Good luck at the tables...

Klopzi said...

I'm gonna join the crowd here and comment on your re-raise PF.

Here's a cold hard truth that I've learned ad nauseum playing in SNGs and tournaments: picking up big hands in level 1 of a tournament is worth crap.

There, I said it! Unless your opponent is donk-tastic or has picked up KK or QQ, you're not making any money with them.

Now, in your case, you're tempted to keep your opponents in it to try and milk some money out of them. Unfortunately, you end up seeing the flop with 3 callers. Your rockets are now underpowered in the face of three donkeys and you will most likely be overvaluing them because, well, you've got Aces!

On the flop, you almost had the right idea. Your best bet is to just bite the bullet and push, hoping that no one has anything. You'll need that fold equity to make the move correct.

Luckily, you ended up all in against one opponent which is exactly what you want. Unfortunately, he hit is flush - it happens.

Just keep at it and remember to play those aces strongly. Early in a tournament, it's a lot better to win a small pot than it is to lose a large one.

(By the way, I've made this same mistake countless times and I've been burned far more times than I've prospered...)

iamhoff said...

Yeah, I think everybody has the right idea, my preflop reraise was too small. I'm honestly not sure what size bet would have gotten the villain to fold, but I'm thinking he would have gone to the mat with anything except an all-in push preflop, and even then he had me covered by 300 or so chips (thanks to his first two suckouts). Short of getting him to fold preflop with a push, I was doomed in this hand. I knew he didn't have anything most a small pair, and with his two earlier hands, I figured he was full of crap and stealing a pot. Oh well. Just one more lesson to file into the brain.

huma said...

I've found in these donkland SNG's the only thing that will get you heads up is something like a 7 to 10BB raise or pot-sized re-raise. Anything else will get multiple callers, or as you said, someone will reraise allin (which is what you want with AA).

I agree with Klopzi that monster hands early on are crappy and will get you into trouble more often than not. I also agree that it's better to take down a small-ish pot in the first levels than to lose a huge one to a sucker. At least a small pot will cover the blinds for the next few orbits while the maniacs knock each other out.

This is my anti-tilt mantra at the moment: you WANT people calling your huge bets with Q7s when you have a legitimate hand. If everyone folded when they're supposed to you would never win any chips.